I have to say I'm pretty disappointed in HN right now. I came to this thread hoping to see some good discussion but instead there's just a bunch of crap. I see a lot of complaining and comments at a very superficial level. Can we talk about the competition and their different strategies? Can we talk about any of the new things presented and whether or not they are interesting or valuable, and why? Can we talk about the technology? Can we talk about how Sony seems to have gone out of their way to court indie developers but MS didn't even mention them here?