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>I'm going to stay and fight and try to make whatever impact I can.

Can you give me some examples of how you would fight?

Boss comes in (or whoever more powerful than me, e.g. someone acting on the president's orders), says something with the gist of "Do this, or get fired". What are the next steps that I can take that won't get me fired, but also count as fighting back?



Comply but leak the truth to the media.

Comply in a maximally obstructive way.

Comply just enough to not get fired but not as much as someone who may be more inclined to please their boss.

Enlist other opposition and find ways to multiply your obstructive compliance into other departments.

There's tons of "how-to" guides on how to maliciously comply with work demands without getting fired.


> Comply but leak the truth to the media.

Doesn't apply, everybody knows what's going on already.

> Comply in a maximally obstructive way.

Doesn't apply, the whole point is that the executive wants to obstruct things, and that's what we're talking about fighting against.

> Comply just enough to not get fired but not as much as someone who may be more inclined to please their boss.

Doesn't apply, you can't half-fire the specified people, or give just a little bit of money to the people you've been instructed not to fund. You can comply, or not, and it's not going to be any kind of secret which way you chose.

If you want to go out in a blaze of glory and leave the building a day later than you otherwise would, with less dignity, go for it.

> Enlist other opposition and find ways to multiply your obstructive compliance into other departments.

It's just not that kind of role.


>> Comply in a maximally obstructive way.

> Doesn't apply, the whole point is that the executive wants to obstruct things, and that's what we're talking about fighting against.

"Obstructive" in this scenario results in the organization keeping functioning effectively. Obstructive of something destructive allows it to keep existing.


> Obstructive of something destructive allows it to keep existing.

Right, but with whose money?


I'm pointing out a definitional misunderstanding. It's was a double negative misinterpreted as a single negative.


I see your point, but I think you are missing their point.

They are saying, the action taken by the administration is to cut funding to the department. This can't really be "obstructed" short of the director using their personal funds to pay people's salaries. It would require either people to work for free, or an outside source of money.


It's hard to "maliciously comply" or be obstructive to someone giving you 55% less budget. They just... give you less money. That's it.

I guess you could slow down the firing process for a bit? That would be a minor obstruction for a short period of time. Then what?

Anyways, "how-to" guides on malicious compliance probably don't tackle situations where an external team, acting on behalf of the president, come into your workplace with unparalleled authority to do whatever they please.


Congress is the body that decides budget, not the President. Convince Congress and you will win budget, and legislative directives to accomplish specific tasks. Putting a man on the moon required Congress.

People are now routinely absolving GOP Congress critters, when they are the actual decision makers.


I'm not sure how the NSF Director should/could by themselves convince congress to not do the funding cut, but sure.


Fred Rogers managed it with PBS. https://www.americanrhetoric.com/speeches/fredrogerssenatete... Then again, that was Mr Rogers.


By back briefing them about all the impacts on their district/State, the stocks the own, the donors they will alienate, the attack material it provides their opponents, and conversely the opportunity to seize national prominence and respect of mega corps, science believers and donors.

Play hardball, that's the job.


They all leak, mostly to cause firings they want.

None of the other points achives win in some kind of fight. They are just turning you into a bitter looser that will be set aside one way or the other - and who still has to do unethical ornillegal things in the process.


> There's tons of "how-to" guides on how to maliciously comply with work demands without getting fired.

These only apply to countries where the judicial system doesn't bend to whoever's in power.


This comment doesn't make sense if you're aware of the content of the guides under discussion.

Subversion is the goal of them. To be successful requires time and not getting found out. It requires plausible deniability.


Cool, how does the NSF director subvert with plausible deniability?


Maybe the NSF director should confer with their GS peers in other services:

https://www.cia.gov/stories/story/the-art-of-simple-sabotage...


That exact book states that sabotage should only be done with plausible deniability, so I ask again...


So you'll ask... What?

I'm not sure what you're asking at this point.

It's a book about sabotage over a long period of time, written in particular to partisans of various countries.

Plausible deniability is the CIA operating method.

"How to do shit to subvert large orgs covertly via death by a thousand cuts" is another title for the manuscript, in some universe, somewhere.


The other Trump malingerers are giving adept examples of how to ape compliance while going completely against the law. Complying with the law in contravention of DOGE wishes should be simple in comparison.


Okay, if they have, then please explain to me what they did differently.


If you're in a hierarchical structure and someone higher up gives you an ultimatum, your choices are: comply, resist and face consequences, or find subversive, incremental ways to undermine it. None of those are cost-free.

"Fighting" isn't about magic moves that keep everything safe. It's about choosing when and how to accept the risks. Expecting a fight with no threat to your position is cowardice disguised as pragmatism.


>or find subversive, incremental ways to undermine it.

I'm asking for concrete examples of what "subversive, incremental ways to undermine it" would be.

You basically just reworded the vague suggestion of "fight back". What are some specific examples of what the NSF director could have done that are subversive, incremental ways to undermine the orders which ultimately came from the president?


In labor circles, the "subversive, incremental ways" are known as "work to rule".

You simply do as you're told. Orders are never completely without ambiguity, and the person giving the order has less direct experience with the subject than the person receiving the order. There's wiggle room.

Concrete example: The order is "Do X". The person charged with executing it actually understands that the consequences will be that Y and Z (which the person giving the order cares about) will actually be on fire if you do X.

In a functioning relationship, you speak up and say "Happy to do X, but here's what'll happen, maybe we should consider a different way to achieve your goals". If you're going the subversive route, you say "Sure thing. I'll get right on X. I'll overdeliver on it". Then you do X, and nudge it towards maximally bad impact on Y/Z.

Followed by "Oh, who could've foreseen! Y and Z are in ruins! What would you like me to do, boss?"


Mire things down in bureaucracy. Try and make everything take substantially longer than it should. Throw up hurdles in the face of progress. "Forget" to do important steps in the process so that you have to re-do work. Implement things on the face of it that are correct, but that don't achieve the same result, etc.


If having the NSF offer fewer grants is the administration's goal, as it seems to be, wouldn't this help them along?


I think 4 year olds know how to do that. Follow the exact letter of what they say, but doing everything else outside the bounds of "do this" the way you want to.

I.e. "It's time for bed" means "I'm going to continue to play, just in my bed."

"Go to sleep" means "Pretend to sleep for 5 minutes, then go back to playing." When confronted, say that you woke up after 5 minutes.


What they said is "you get less money" and "fire half the people". One of those you can literally not do anything about. I'm not sure how to fire people but do it in the way is the way "I want to".


If you are a Reddit user r/MaliciousCompliance is full of stories* of people follow orders to the most exacting and absurd extent. Most of them are peon-level folks so I am not sure how those actions would map to a person in a position of real power.

*fact vs embellished fact vs straight fiction is always questionable on Reddit.


I do really enjoy that subreddit, but as you alluded to, I can't think of any stories that would be applicable to the NSF director & president (even if taking them all at face value rather than as writing exercises).


They said to him to fire half of the people, fire everyone then


Keep in mind we are talking about real people. These people are supporting themselves (and likely families). Making thousands more people, above and beyond the mandated amount, lose their employment is not a good outcome. It isn't some management game on steam where we can make decisions like that without second thought.


Don't do it. Perhaps obfuscate and delay as much as possible that you are not actually doing it. Perhaps get fired. Then go to court for wrongful termination (this would depend on the order being unlawful)?


You can't "not do" getting a budget cut. They just give you less money.

I'm also not sure how to just... not fire people. Sure, you can delay it a week or two. Okay. Then what? Get fired for non-compliance? That seems about as effective of a tactic as quitting is.



"Hide perishable foods (fruit) in discreet locations of common areas"

That's helpful for the conversation!

Should I just keep clicking through this entire site until an answer related to my question appears?

(It's a neat site, but... I'm not going to sit here playing go fish until an applicable one-liner appears)


This is what I got: Send people the http:// version of links instead of https://

I actually have no idea how this would disrupt anything.


It would slow down the operation of the organization. In this case, it's counterproductive to the director's aims. The director's goal is to maximize grant funding; a functional bureaucracy is essential for that goal. There is nothing the director can do to increase the funding, which is being cut by an external source. The legality of the funding cut is unclear, but the director has no agency in the outcome of a legal challenge.


But how would sending the http link slow things down?

Most link parsers, browsers, and sites will happily redirect you to available encrypted sites these days.

And even when they don't this is extremely dangerous advice to give for people who aren't technical.


It's a silly novelty website. Maybe this no longer happens, but for a period of time, browsers would present a warning that the website was insecure. The user would need to switch to https by updating the address. It was inconvenient.


You total chaos machine!

Give a wrong time. Stop a traffic line!

I've mentioned it too often and sound like a stuck record, but Jaroslav Hasek's Svejk has it perfected [0]

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Good_Soldier_%C5%A0vejk 11;rgb:0000/0000/0000




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