Out of pocket maximum for silver level HSA eligible health insurance is probably at least $5k if not $7k+. Premiums for a family of 4 are $30k, and if employer pays for 70%, then you are left with $10k.
$20k for federal/local takes. $80k-$20k-$10k is $50k. Max out HSA and 401k is ~$25k or more. $25k left, or roughly $2k/month left for mortgage/rent, food, utilities, car(s), vacations, etc.
Of course, you can not max 401k and HSA, but my opinion would be that is insufficient savings.
Joint tax rate for 80k is 12% federal, so half what you’ve listed for federal. Lcol is likely Tennessee or zero/low state taxes so less than 8k for sure.
Even if huge overestimates on taxes are correct, 2k/mo is achievable. <1k/mo for mortgage and $600 for food if you’re stringent, $400/mo for other expenses. All extremely dependent on being in a very low cost of living area, but 80k is ridiculously higher than a lot of people who live at $14k or 28k/ year if one or two people work at minimum wage.
It’s extremely unlikely they’re maxing 401k as well, most people I know who making 100+ don’t do that. So more realistically 80k, minus 12k for taxes, maybe 5k for health, maybe 5k for 401k, leaves you with 58k.
$30k annual premium is from my W-2 showing how much my gold HSA plan for a family of 4 costs with a $3,400 deductible and $7,250 oop max.
NJ has a nice pdf showing premiums and age rating factors, we can roughly estimate from there (lets use Horizon BCBSNJ Omnia Silver HSA as an example since BCBS is nationwide).
$325 per month per child, ~$500 per month per parent - $20k in premiums for a silver HSA plan in NJ, but this is has a $7k deductible and $14k out of pocket maximum. If an employer wanted to bring those deductible and oop max down, the premium would have to go up quite a bit.
So even in a lower cost of living state, I would estimate at least $25k/year in premiums for a half decent plan for 2 adults and 2 kids.
You are right that $20k in taxes might be high, but I was figuring income tax and 1% to 2% property taxes and maybe even tolls/vehicle registration/etc to be safe.
>It’s extremely unlikely they’re maxing 401k as well, most people I know who making 100+ don’t do that. So more realistically 80k, minus 12k for taxes, maybe 5k for health, maybe 5k for 401k, leaves you with 58k.
Yes, I assume 90% of Americans are not saving per my comfort levels.
I didn’t make enough to max out my 401k until I hit my 40s but always had a rainy day fund (8 month runway). I guess I lost the compounding for all those years but I still have enough.
As an immigrant I’ve always lived so close to the edge financially that I feel I don’t have the same expectations of most native born folks of what retirement looks like (I don’t plan to retire, but if I’m forced to I’m planning for 70s not 65). To me it just means I have to be hustling all the time. I don’t feel I’m hard done by or financially insecure though. I’ve lived with very little (I was technically below the poverty line in undergrad — I really stretched my dollar) and now I’m relatively comfortable but it’s all the same.
My parents were immigrants, and my expectations are because I saw them work 24/7 to barely scrape together a life for my younger sister and I. I was specifically told to be careful while playing, because a doctor or hospital visit would set the family back.
If I did not have kids, my comfort level would be a lot lower. But I feel like I decided to bring them into the world, and so I owe it to them to bed financially secure enough to provide them healthcare and my time.
$20k for federal/local takes. $80k-$20k-$10k is $50k. Max out HSA and 401k is ~$25k or more. $25k left, or roughly $2k/month left for mortgage/rent, food, utilities, car(s), vacations, etc.
Of course, you can not max 401k and HSA, but my opinion would be that is insufficient savings.