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This is just brilliant.

AN-26 shooting, allegedly by rebels, proofs that malaysian boeing was shot by rebels.

By that logic UA did this because it shot down russian civil plane in 2001, admitting it after months.


You have it backwards. All the piles of evidence that they shot down the MA flight indicate they probably also had the capability two days ago to shoot down the AN-26, and therefore probably did.


UA has the very same capability since USSR days and therefore probably did.


Let me spell it out for you then - Ukraine had no interest in shooting down it's own cargo plane. Russia would not likely risk firing a missile from within it's own territory. Who does that leave us? Maybe the people who claim ownership of the space, have the means, and are tweeting about their supposed AN-26 shootdowns? If this is trolling, it's bad trolling.


Insert suggestion of false-flag operation in 3, 2, 1...


Well, if there hadn't been any apparent false flag operations in recent times that _would be a ridiculous thing to suggest.

As it is, who knows? Sites can be hacked, that we know. And we know some parties have continued interest in stirring up trouble in the region.

Was it a false flag operation? Probably not. But if we see a party trying to take advantage of the situation, or escalate conflict over the situation, it will be a bit more suspicious, and that suggestion may be worth considering.

If it was a military error it was a military error. But if it was indeed parties with economic interests destroying human lives in order to court opinion... well that would be despicable and of the lowest order of criminality.


Accusations of false flag this early are just a smokescreen, someone trying to muddy the waters due to political sympathies - until someone takes advantage of the situation, one can't reasonably claim false flag without sounding like a loon. I'm not saying false flag doesn't or can't happen, just that you at least need to have a bit more information come to light before you can take it seriously as an option, and you need to see how those with a lot to gain take advantage of the event.

Hell, saying Ukraine did this as false flag seems especially loony - Russia was drawing down it's forces on the border, down to about 1,000 soldiers (down from over 40,000). Why would they intentionally stir the pot when things were going as they needed them to?


> Ukraine had no interest in shooting down it's own cargo plane.

Cargo -- no. MA plane -- very much.

Their so-called ATO (in reality, genocide) failed just recently. Some of their troops were surrounded at UA-RU border by rebels, they are desorganised, some are fleeing into Russia even.

At this point Kiev needs something.


and shooting down civilian plane helps them how?


I was wondering how long it would be before one of you showed up...

http://www.forbes.com/sites/peterhimler/2014/05/06/russias-m...


If you'd follow the story from the very beginning, you'd understand why those "we have Buk" posts were made.



There are also claims that UA was really trying to shoot Russian Plane #1 which was flying close to malaysian boeing both in time and space

There are many claims.


Why on Earth would Ukraine try to shoot down Putin? To get absolutely sure they'll be annihilated by Russia??


Since the beginning of the conflict UA did everything they can to provoke Russia into crossing border.

Well, almost everything.


A curious statement. How were they doing that? By letting the rebels take over their cities and airfields? By letting Russia have Crimea?


People burned alive in Odessa.

Many people (noncombatants) killed in Lugansk from BM-21 "Grad" bombings.

Artillery shooting near UA-RU border, killing two soldiers.

Shooting over cross-border stations while refugees were trying to escape into Russia.

Many episodes.

Kiev declared that 'terrorists' (familiar word, isn't it?) are in Lugansk and Donetsk and started shooting over whole population regardless.


> People burned alive in Odessa.

That was interesting incident.

There was a peaceful protest, that was attacked by (pro-)Russian militants with guns. Then the crowd started to defend itself, the attackers retreated and barricaded themselves in a wooden building. They were still shooting into the crowd and throwing Molotov's cocktails. The crowd was was mostly unarmed save for it's own Molotov's cocktails.

Barricading inside wooden building and throwing fire around is not especially smart idea. That's how it ended, also.


There are plenty of Russian soldiers that crossed the border already.


Putin himself has crossed border already.

I think it is best for me to leave this little Intellectual Curiosity Club.


You filled your quota for the day?


Reminds me of 'add "over the Internet" and patent' tactics.


Less syscalls.


No. read(2) is one syscall, and the cost of the initial open is negligible. One real motivation seems to be wanting programs to work without a /dev. I don't think that's a reasonable requirement.


Access to /dev is DOS'able in many situations by exhausting file descriptor / open files limits.


> Access to /dev is DOS'able in many situations by exhausting file descriptor / open files limits.

That's why you open /dev/urandom in advance of performing operations that require randomness. If that open fails, you don't go on to perform the operation that requires randomness.


Even if you have opened it, you have no guarantee that the file descriptor has not been closed since. Yes, that would be stupid of the user of the library, but many security lapses happens because people makes stupid assumptions. Code to close all file descriptors on fork for example is fairly common, so you can not safely assume that the file descriptor remains valid.


> Even if you have opened it, you have no guarantee that the file descriptor has not been closed since.

You can absolutely rely on internal file descriptors not being closed. A program that closes file descriptors it does not own is as buggy as a program that calls free on regions of memory it does not own. A library cannot possibly be robust against this form of sabotage. The correct response to EBADF on a read of an internal file descriptor is to call abort.

The "close all file descriptors" operation is most common before exec. After exec, the process is a new program that can open /dev/urandom on its own (since, as I've mentioned previously, it's a broken environment in which /dev/urandom does not exist).


> You can absolutely rely on internal file descriptors not being closed.

I've explained several times why you can't. The program that closes all file descriptors may be broken, but the big problem is that as long as the library has no safe way of reporting this to the caller without breaking the OpenSSL API, they are faced with either breaking a ton of applications or finding an alternative. And they've explained why this is not an alternative (in the copious comments in the soure):

> The correct response to EBADF on a read of an internal file descriptor is to call abort.

They have no control over whether or not this will result in an insecurely written core file that can leak data, and this is a common problem. If the person building the library knows that the environment it will be used in does not have that problem, it's one define to disable the homegrown entropy.

> The "close all file descriptors" operation is most common before exec.

I've seen it in plenty of code that did not go on to exec, to e.g. drop privileges for portion of the code.


> I've explained several times why you can't

OpenSSL is crufty in part because it's full of workarounds for ancient, crufty code. LibreSSL shouldn't repeat that mistake. LibreSSL does have ways to report allocation failure errors to callers. It shouldn't even try to work around problems arising from applications corrupting the state of components that happen to share the same process. That task is hopeless and leads to code paths that are very difficult to analyze and test. You're more likely to create an exploitable bug by trying to cope with corruption than actually solve a problem --- and closing file descriptors other components own is definitely a form of corruption.

> [LibreSSL has] no control over whether or not [abort] will result in an insecurely written core file

The security of core files simply isn't LibreSSL's business. The mere presence of LibreSSL in a process does not indicate that a process contains sensitive information. LibreSSL has no right to replace system logic for abort diagnostics. If the developers believe that abort() shouldn't write core files for all programs or some programs or some programs in certain states, they should implement that behavior on their own systems. They shouldn't try to make that decision for other systems. LibreSSL's behavior here is not only harmful, but insufficient, as the library can't do anything about other calls to abort, or actual crashes, in the same process.

> I've seen it in plenty of code that did not go on to exec, to e.g. drop privileges for portion of the code.

Please name a program that acts this way.


> No.

open+read+close + all the mess associated with exhausting file descriptors > getentropy

fairly obvious, isn't it?


Of course getentropy would be better. But the current mechanism is not wrong or broken: at best, it's inconvenient. And it's certainly no excuse for the LibreSSL authors to write a library that calls raise(SIGKILL) on file descriptor exhaustion. That behavior, in many cases, amounts to a remote DoS. As long as this code is in the library (even if off by default), I'm hesitant to recommend LibreSSL.


Without a way to getentropy(2) [hint] that doesn't use file descriptors, it has no other secure choice but to raise(SIGKILL) in my opinion; a mere error might be overlooked, but continuing to run could expose secrets and keys, which is much worse than a DoS condition (anything in file-descriptor exhaustion when under attack is already being DoSsed). (It's turned off because coredumps could also do that locally.)


It's behind a define so there's no problem, don't turn it on if you don't like it. You'd never execute that code anyway, because you're the smart admin who knows better and always has the right devices in all the chroots. And who cares about other users! If they don't know better, they're doing it wrong. Put the blame on them. There is no problem.


> Increasing the max setting does not consume additional resources. It merely makes it possible for applications to get the resources they ask for.

From unswappable kernel memory, yeah.

> kernel.pid_max = 999999

> * - nproc unlimited

1.000.000 pids is 1 mil task_struct's.

On my quite stripped out kernel 14 task_struct's fit into order 3 slab -- 14 objects per 32KB or kernel memory.

1000000 / 14 * 32 * 1024 = 2.18 GB of kernel memory

and that's not even counting other kernel structures!


Note, vm.overcommit_memory is not even mentioned.

How disappointing.


> From spring straight to winter?

That would be Ukraine, where two Russian journalists were killed recently during bombing of Lugansk.


The death of journalists during intense fighting is - while extremely tragic and hopefully rare - not at all comparable to them getting sentenced by courts for simply reporting news. The former is to some degree unavoidable (if they got target specifically then everything changes), while the latter is an explicit act of government against freedom of press and speech.


In back then USSR liberal loonies cried that "freedom of choice between 2 or more candidates in elections" is all you need.


I didn't know about "debug" until this post because I used "ignore_loglevel" for years.

Kernel is fun.


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